Full Transcript
So sometimes it’s we have to run it longer, sometimes it’s the exact right amount. It’s just whatever. But yeah, I always have to do it from the back. Most of that is most of the things we that I when I’m editing, I have to start from the end to line things up. Are you are you smiling because you’re trying to think of a like a from the back joke? I feel like in your eyes, you’re like, how do I work doing it from the back into a joke? And this is catriarchs. So we’re in the middle of Pride Month, so I figure why don’t we talk about poop?
Gavin:
Absolutely. Absolutely on brand.
David:
I have to, I, I I brought this up because I was like, I have to admit this on our show because it’s important for our listeners to understand that I am also disgusting.
Gavin:
Um if tech wasn’t already completely clear.
David:
So, first of all, in general, my my son is now fully poly potty trained, but for whatever reason, he demands I watch him poop. So whenever he has to poop, he goes, Daddy, I have to poop. And I’m like, Go poop. You know how you do the bath. You go to all the time. And he’s like, come watch me poop. Now there’s no arguing with him because he’ll just poop in his pants unless you watch him. So now I sit on the floor while he sits in the toilet and we have a really great conversation. I don’t know why this is happening. I don’t know why he wants me to watch him poop, but I have to watch him poop right now. But that’s not the story.
Gavin:
Okay, well, I I was gonna say, I wonder if this is universal because I I’ve heard this a lot. And my kids were public poopers as well, um, social poopers. And my my favorite was watching having, in particular, my uh daughter, she would be talking to me very intently about her day, you know, something frivolous and light. And then suddenly she gets that look in her face where she just far off look. The far-off look, and then plop plop. It’s uh oh, I miss those days. I do miss it.
David:
Well, so let’s see if you miss them after this. So I was out with my one-year-old. She’s she’s obviously still on diapers, and we were within a block of the house. So I didn’t bring the bag, I didn’t bring the toy, like the wipes, all the things. We were just gonna kind of play in this neighbor’s yard. It was very sweet. Let us play in our yard.
Gavin:
Yeah.
David:
And somehow we kind of migrated to the far park. And the whole time I was thinking, well, should I bring the bag? I was like, no, it’s fine if she needs a diaper, whatever. Um, well, we’ll just go back to the house. Well, eventually we get really far, and of course, I see the far-off look in her eyes. Oh no. She just gets quiet and she’s like, I’m like, oh fuck. Because I’m like, well, I don’t want to carry her in her own like, you know, I don’t want to squeeze the poop up or whatever, but also I don’t have a diaper on me. So I’m like, well, maybe she wasn’t really pooping. So I look in her diaper, yep, there’s a fucking giant pile of poop. But it is like hard, dry poop. And so I go, huh. And so I take Hannah, my daughter, and I walk her behind some trees, and I pull her little diaper down like halfway, and I just like boop, kind of like the old lady in Titanic throws the heart of the ocean in. I kind of make the same noise. She does the same thing, and I kind of go, boop, and the just little solid brick of poop shoots out, lands behind the tree. I pull her diaper right up and we walk the fuck out of the park. Yes, and so that is me being dad of the year, and now she has a clean diaper, and we can just stroll the way back home.
Gavin:
Oh, I love that story, and everybody had to just say, wow, Gabin, don’t laugh so loudly. But I mean, it’s just it’s it’s survival, yo.
David:
It’s survival, and also I believe you should clean up after your dogs. But listen, when my one-year-old poops in her pants, I’m gonna throw that shit whatever I want.
Gavin:
I mean, one of the conveniences of being a boy slash having a little boy is peeing in public.
David:
My son yesterday was peeing in the front yard, and I said, Emmett, what are you doing? He goes, I had to go. I said, You have to go inside in a toilet. He’s like, but I like peeing in the front yard. So now we are the redneck fucking neighbors with the three-year-old who pisses in the front yard. I mean, my God, never let gaze into your neighborhood.
Gavin:
Well, I I don’t know how many times I would be in public playgrounds in New York City with eyeballs all over the place. And I got to the point where I would say to my kids, just just just don’t even ask. Just go. Just go do it. So, because if you ask me, and I’m having a conversation with this person next to me, I mean, frankly, we’re all in the same boat, right? Like, what parent isn’t gonna be like, God damn it, I don’t want to have to pick up there is not a bathroom here at this playground. I don’t want you to go to the the McDonald’s that’s actually more disgusting than you just peeing behind a bush. Just go pee behind a bush real quick. I mean, I in a city like New York City, you can’t have millions of kids doing that, and yet at the same time, there’s got to be a better solution than having to leave the friggin’ playground. But we’re so puritanical about every everything from sex to peeing and pooping. We all do it.
David:
So Kavan, I have pooped and peed in so many public places in New York City. It would I someday, I won’t do it today, but someday I’ll tell you the the story of me peeing on the in train on the way home from a club one day. It was horrific. But like there’s no public bathrooms in New York City, and also there’s something about being a guy and peeing outside that feels really good. Like when you’re camping and you just pee outside, why does it feel so good? So like I don’t blame him for wanting to do that. Um, one thing I wanted to bring up today, too. I had talked a couple episodes, oh no, many episodes ago, about daycare um parties, right? Like when you have a party for your kid and you invite everyone from daycare and they’re so expensive, and these brilliant parents are like splitting the parties, right? So that that was a that was a huge life hack I learned, and I think is really great. Um, I found a new hack that’s even better than that because somebody in my daycare did it, and I think it’s fucking brilliant. So it was uh somebody had posted in the in the daycare group, hey, it’s this girl’s birthday. Um, don’t bring lunch. She’s providing pizza and cake and all these things. And of course, my first thought is like, of course, I’m getting more pizza and cake into my kid. Yeah. My God, around it. I know it. And he comes home with these like goodie bags. You know how like you have to make goodie bags for the kids who come to your party now? Sure. And so he came, uh, he came home and I realized she didn’t have to do a birthday party.
SPEAKER_02:
Oh.
David:
She made daycare her birthday party, and all she had to do was pay for pizzas and cake and goodie bags. And the venue was daycare because all of those same kids would have been the kids who had to go totally to the expensive place. Oh my god, it was such a mind fuck. I was like, that is so brilliant. Not only is the sharing of the birthday brilliant, but the fact that you’re just like, you know what? You’re you’re just gonna be with these kids anyway. So, life hack. So, guess what I meant? On your fourth birthday, daycare party.
Gavin:
Yeah. I mean, the the hey, we’re all just trying to get by, and I think that was genius. Um, it’s too bad that you didn’t think about it and save money on the last birthday, but good. I’m glad you’re gonna take that forward. So um, we are at our top three list. And do you recall the topic this week?
David:
Yes, because I legitimately spent more time thinking about this top three list than anything we’ve had so far because I got so excited. Because as soon as I came up with some ideas, I’m like, oh wait, but this one, but that one, but this one. So I had to be, yeah. So I had to be really I I want I gave myself a very, very narrow box to fit this in. I wanted to make sure that these were movies or TV shows that I saw before coming out. Okay. Because there was a lot of things that came to my mind, but I was like, but I was already out of the closet. Um, and also something that for whatever reason made me feel the gayest. And that maybe wasn’t the sexiest movie of the time, but that somehow lit something in me. So I’m very excited about this.
Gavin:
Oh my god. Oh no, it’s pretty superficial. Just wait, just wait.
David:
So anyway, you go first.
Gavin:
Yes, well, okay, so number three on my list, I have to admit, is Top Gun. Because back in the day, that football scene where they’re all just running around with their shirts off playing uh football on the beach. I was like, huh. I wonder I and I I saw it when I was young enough that I didn’t get what was the feelings that I was feeling, but I was like, hmm, I want to be those guys. Or do I want to be inside those guys? I was gonna say do those, but that’s that’s way better. This is why you’re the funny guy. So number two is Clue. Let me tell you why. Definitely no hot torsos in that movie. But there is a moment that Madeline Kahn, and you wouldn’t know this because you haven’t. I’ve never seen it. I know. We should have a movie watch party. Let’s have a live YouTube stream of you watching. Oh, yeah, like a Gatriarch’s viewing party. I love it. Yeah. Which would also be the most boring thing we’ve ever done ever. And you’re gonna think that why does anybody care about this movie? Anyway, Madeline Kahn has this brilliant moment of slapstick comedy where she does her famous flames, flames, I’ve heard I’ve seen that done a million times. Breathing, heaving, breathing, and I knew it was funny on a visceral level that other people around me didn’t get. At a gay icon level.
David:
That’s what it was.
Gavin:
At a gay icon level, I got the movie in a different way than other people did, even than my mom got. And so I knew there was something going on by clue. Number one, from 1985, there is a movie of He-Man. Oh my god. And the way He-Man.
David:
Please tell me it was Skeletor and not He-Man. Because they were both fucking ripped. Every one of them were so muscular.
Gavin:
Tila, uh Cyborg bot dude, Skeletor, and He-Man, all of them with those those chests, those chests. I was at Josh Hanley’s sleepover in 1985, and I’m like, I don’t think anybody likes this movie quite as much as I do. What about you, David F. M. Bark?
David:
Okay, so um, like I said, these are very personal to me. For whatever reason, these ones stoked the flames. Um, my number three, I think a lot of people my age would think is number one, but now number three, Brad Pitt and Fight Club. When he opened the door wearing those kitchen gloves, shirtless. That’s the like the famous photo from the thing. I remember it it pinging something in my spinal fluid, and I went, what is that feeling? What does that mean? Um number two, borderline embarrassing. Kevin Costner in Dances with Wolves.
Gavin:
Oh okay. Okay.
David:
I had the double VHS copy of this, and there’s a scene where like the camera is on a like a dolly or or something, it’s going just past him. Like he’s like bathing in a river, but he’s like kind of behind some reeds, so it’s kind of hard to see, but you definitely see his ass. When I tell you I rewound and played that hundreds of times, I am not joking with you. I was something his ass, I was like, I want that.
Gavin:
Do you think that was pre like the oversexualization, I think, of the entire world? Do you think that Kevin Costner worked on doing more uh squats to have a great ass? Because he knew he was gonna be a good one.
David:
No, I think in those days they just were like, you are hot enough be naked. You’re hot enough, right? Yeah, oof, man. Number two. And number one, there is a scene in the original Foot Loose where Kevin Bacon and Chris Penn, who play uh Ren and Willard, are talking to this actor named John Lachlan, who plays Woody, and they’re in like the showers, and in the background behind them, you see boys going in and out of the showers, and you see naked butts. And there’s one scene where you like almost see a penis, it’s like bush, it’s like it’s penis adjacent. And I re-watched that when I was thinking about this list, and every uh phrase of the dialogue that’s happening is ingrained in my memory because I watched that video over and over and over again because you could see these butts, these like real butts in there. And I want to give a side shout out to John Lachlan, who played uh Woody, which was kind of like one of Willard’s friends or some of the high schooler guys. So magnificently hot, so hot in that like late 80s, early 90s kind of way. Um, he’s still an actor. I looked him up. He’s still like, he’s like doing, you know, the SVUs. I think he’s like he’s in his 60s now, but like he was so super hot. But anyway, that scene, that scene hit me in a way where I was like, oh yeah, I’m I’m a gay person. That’s I want to give a special shout out to Cillian Murphy and 28 Days Later. Now, technically that movie came out in 2002, but the opening scene where he wakes up in the hospital naked, and he’s like, it’s not a sexy scene, like he’s naked in a hospital, he’s not erect, there’s no like sex happening, but ooh, is that a hot man? But that I came out in 2001, so that was a 2002 movie. Yeah, doesn’t it?
Gavin:
Well, well, we can have the before and the after uh closeted versions of uh favorite movies that made us feel a little thundered down under, okay? We can come back to this. Love it. What will we be talking about next time?
David:
So next week, in celebration of Pride, it’s towards the end of the month now. We’re almost at the end of Pride Month right now. And with all the hoopla there is, we are gonna do the top three baby drag names. Love it.
Gavin:
Okay, top three baby drag names. Ooh. We are so lucky to be joined today by my friend Corter Simmons, who is both an actor and a drag queen, which is often cross-pollinated, but is really two separate career paths. So talk about a working girl. Um, his drag name is Cacophony Daniels. You already know her, Cacophani Daniels, but you might not know Corter Simmons. There we go. He performs with a weekly show on Mondays at The Spot, which is at 10th and 43rd, doing musical theater Mondays. And as Corter says, it’s a drag stravaganza. That’s a hard one.
SPEAKER_02:
So it is.
Gavin:
He typed it out. He typed drag stravaganza. I sure did. And and Google Docs did not like drag stravaganza, but we are gonna change that today with you. Corter, how was your kid an asshole today?
SPEAKER_03:
Um, actually, I mean, I haven’t spoken to him yet today, so because I’m in Arizona and he’s in New York. So uh today, so far, knock on wood, although we did get uh an email, he’s going to a fantastic online school right now. Um and we got an email that he’s inexplicably missing, you know, three assignments from a class that he started a week ago. So that’s how he was an asshole today. Absolutely.
Gavin:
It is uh, but you are lucky enough to be in Arizona for a while all alone. Like you get to sleep in a bed in starfish pose and not have to be woken up by anybody. I mean, how is your time being away from the family right now?
SPEAKER_03:
Um, it’s great and sucks, right? Because um, like I I love um having time to myself. I love getting up at my own pace in the mornings and not having to be up and and uh yell at someone to you know clean off their desk so they can be at school and hurry up and eat your fucking fruity pebbles and um and all of that. It’s wonderful not to have to do that. But then of course I miss them. And you know, and when it’s you know after work and after I’m done and I’m here by myself, I’m like, oh, I wish we were all snuggling on the couch watching Bridgerton instead of just me or something.
David:
I wish I was I wish I was yelling at somebody to put on their shoes.
SPEAKER_03:
It just feels right right now.
David:
Yeah.
Gavin:
Totally. And so wait, quarter, uh give us two seconds about uh why are you in Arizona right now?
SPEAKER_03:
I am uh doing the actor part of my job, which is um I’m doing a play out here um at the Arizona Theater Company called The Legend of Georgia McBride, which opens on June 9th here in Tucson, and then again on July 1st in Phoenix. Uh it’s a unique thing here where they’re the like one of the only regional theaters here in Arizona, so they perform in both of the major cities, which is great.
Gavin:
So sometimes David and I have talked about being multi-hyphenates, and we like to pretend like um fluff our hair and say, Oh, yes, I’m a multi-this, that, the other. But you are truly not just a triple threat. You are what do you call yourself? A qua a quin tuple? I bet it’s a sex tuple. Sex tuple. A hundred percent of a sex tuple. Absolutely.
SPEAKER_03:
And um, I’m not gonna tell you what the other talents are, but they’re there for sure.
David:
We can see them from here. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yep.
Gavin:
Actor, singer, dancer, drag queen, MC, high heel triathlete, probably of all the kinds.
David:
Like uh Wait, have you ever done one of those races in heels? I see those on TikTok all the time.
SPEAKER_03:
I have seen them too, and they look fantastic, and I know it’s for charity, which is wonderful, and I’m so proud of all the people who do it, but abso fucking literally not.
David:
I feel like those are meant for like men who have never worn heels to watch them stumble, not for somebody to literally sachet all the way to the finish line.
SPEAKER_03:
Absolutely. I I mean I am the kind of queen I do not put my shoes on until I’m at the gig and it’s like, okay, are we going in 30 seconds? We’re going in 30 seconds. Now I’ll put the heels on. Because why why give myself the hip pain and the back strain and all of those things when, you know, no, forget it.
David:
Yeah. So wait, so I don’t know you at all. So we’re you and I are gonna get to know each other. So tell me, how did how are you a dad? Like, I think that is a we’ve talked about this before on the show where like every dad has a how did you become a dad story? Because like in the straight world, we know how you became a dad. So like most of the time. But like how how did you become a dad?
SPEAKER_03:
Yeah. Um, so my husband and I were together for a long time, and I was actually uh, as a performer, I was kind of dead set against having kids. Um we uh on our second date, uh, my husband said, Well, by the time I’m 30, I want to be married, and by the time I’m 35, I want to have kids. And I was like, Oh, he’s one of those.
David:
He had like a list, a checklist, got it.
SPEAKER_03:
Yes, his he’s always talking about the five-year plan, and I’m like, What are you talking about?
David:
He’s like sex on Wednesdays at 7 45 p.m.
SPEAKER_03:
So I got it. I wish. Anyway, um, so um, so it took me a long time, and it actually Gavin was really instrumental in moving the needle for me because I met, I started meeting Gavin um at our friend Um friends Marcy and Randy. Um have a fabulous apartment on 55th Street where they have this amazing rooftop deck and they would throw parties on there.
Gavin:
I remember the very conversation, even though I had forgotten now five years later that you have a kid, but yes.
SPEAKER_03:
And yeah, and um, you know, so we were and you had brought, I think, one or both of the kids to this particular event.
Gavin:
Yeah, probably.
SPEAKER_03:
And they were very, very, very young.
Gavin:
Because it was Marcy, it was a birthday party for their kid, right?
SPEAKER_03:
I think, yeah, absolutely.
Gavin:
Possibly.
SPEAKER_03:
Yeah. And so we were there and and we started talking, and and I was sitting there watching Gavin, who was a performer, um, you know, and who had kids, and I was like, well shit. I mean, all of these barriers that I had, you know, to um being able to uh you know have the money and the time and be able to focus on myself while still focusing on this other human. Um, you know, I was seeing, you know, Gavin be able to make those things work.
Gavin:
Um and I had a new, you know, half-acidly in both ways. I wasn’t exactly a working actor at the time, I don’t think.
SPEAKER_03:
Well, but no, but but you know what I mean. Like we and and you know, and it came to the point where like me, I guess Gavin meeting you and hearing your story was the last straw, I guess that like let it all fall into it.
David:
It’s often the last straw. Gabin is often the last straw for a lot of people for a lot of things.
Gavin:
Oh, I take so much abuse here. But yes, so so moving forward, you moving forward.
SPEAKER_03:
So I kind of I had this awaken and I was like, okay, we could do this. And I came home literally that night and I said to my husband, Okay, I’m ready, let’s do this. And he was like, What? Yes. And so then we kind of just you know started. So we looked into surrogacy, of course, which, you know, unless we wanted to sell all of our internal organs we couldn’t afford. Um, and we um then uh looked into, you know. But you would look snatched as um Yeah, like we all would look cute with one less kidney.
David:
That’s all I’m saying.
Gavin:
Just cinch it up in the middle. Daniels, cacophony Daniels would have been all about missing some organs.
SPEAKER_03:
Absolutely. No. Who needs this lung? It’s anything.
Gavin:
Anything for that waste. Continue. Yeah. And to have a baby who’s then gonna ruin that cacophony’s life. But anyway, keep going.
SPEAKER_03:
Totally. Yeah, so then we looked into like traditional adoption as well, and that was kind of nuts. The process of that seemed really daunting to us. And the idea for us, especially with my career, and my husband is a nonprofit executive, and he’s pretty high up on the ladder of things. So he’s very busy too, career-wise. And so looking at that, we thought, okay, a baby and like an infant is so many things that we’re not sure we can take care of. Um, as far as like, you know, constant daycare, and you can’t even get them into like daycare, daycare until they’re a certain amount of years old and you know, all those kinds of things. And so we thought, okay, so maybe an older kid is the way to go for us. And in our minds, we were thinking, okay, like four to seven, you know, something like that, where there’s still really little and very impressionable and you know, all that kind of stuff, and but can like tell you what’s wrong when something is wrong, rather than just screaming for hours and you don’t know what’s happening.
Gavin:
And like because you have enough of that going on anyway.
SPEAKER_03:
No, absolutely, absolutely, and you know, all of that, and so then we kind of finally came to okay, then let’s look into the foster system. And once we did that and learned how many kids there are in the system who need homes and all of that, we were like, absolutely, yes, this is what we’re going to do. Um, so we took a year to become licensed as foster parents. Um, that you know, you have to go to classes, and you have I mean, it’s all the things that like every parent should have to do.
David:
I was just gonna say, like, they make us jump through hoops, and you’re like, uh, I know some straight people who could use these hoops.
SPEAKER_03:
Basically, all of them. I mean, like, I I mean, I literally, and you know, it was just like, you know, how how to, you know, take care of a kid, A, but also how to take care of kids who are in the system who, you know, all kids in the system are traumatized because they’ve been removed from their home, whatever that was, and however horrible it was, it’s still like a this trauma traumatizing event, right? So we have to learn how to take care of their trauma too. Um and we so we did all that, and then there’s home study after home study after home study, and you know, all this kind of stuff. And I gotta say, in that home study, we were really nervous about the drag part of my life. Um, we and so we kind of, I mean, it was still there, but we’re like, you know, the dress form that was in the living room with what with the you know, was like moved to a closet. And well, let’s put all the wigs kind of over here, and you know, we kind of minimized, we kind of tried to shrink the drag and the gay as much as possible in that. Um, which sucks that we felt that we had to do, but is something that’s absolutely out there.
Gavin:
But and as much as that, I mean, hey, you you you’re doing what you have to do to get by, and does it feel like a compromise? Hey, everybody just step off with your judgment. I I was doing what I needed to do, and now, but you’re not exactly hiding your drag now.
David:
We talked about well, we talked about that last last week. We talked about how like traveling sometimes we you you change maybe your voice, or if you’re holding your partner’s hand, and then you have that internal struggle in your head of like, God, I feel fucking shitty about doing that. Why did I put the dress form in the closet? But at the same time, I did it in an order to protect myself and my family, and yeah, right. Totally.
SPEAKER_03:
Exactly. And and you never know who’s gonna walk through the door with what biases they have and all of that. So, yeah. So, you know, we did all of that, and then um my husband started looking through these websites that are out there called Heart Galleries, where there are kids who are available for adoption um in the foster system. Uh, it’s like it’s gross, it’s like Tinder, but for adopting kids, it’s because it’s like it’s so gross.
David:
People don’t understand, like I’ve never done that. We did surrogacy, but it was it felt the same way about looking for egg donors. I was like, I’m flipping through this weird tender profile of like genetic material. It does not feel good. This feels really uncomfortable. Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:
Yeah. And you’re like, oh, no, you know, too many disabilities, no, too old. I mean, like all of those things are like You’re like, oh no, that shirt, no, thank you.
David:
No kid of mine, right? Right? No kid of mine’s wearing Lacoste. Come on. Absolutely.
SPEAKER_03:
Yeah, no.
David:
Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:
Absolutely. So, you know, what we did finally, like, so uh we’re going through all these things, and my husband came uh upon our son’s profile, and um uh, you know, he sent it to me. I was working out of town at the time, he sent it to me, and he said, I think this is our kid. And I was like, Okay. So, you know, I looked at it and there was this video, and he was um, you know, talking about, you know, the things he liked to do, and I love macaroni and cheese, and I love hot dogs, and you know, whatever, and I like to play with my toys, and I like to sing. And then he kind of did this like exactly, and then he did this like kind of you can’t see it, the listeners, but he did this very, very fabulous.
David:
One of us. One of us. Exactly, exactly.
SPEAKER_03:
And it like Don’t Some sugar in the tank. You went, oh and we went, oh God, okay, so here is this kid who’s probably going to be gay. And you know, you can’t tell, but you can tell, right? And um, you know, and what an amazing opportunity to not only like have a kid who’s like so much like us and we have so much in common with, A, but B, like help out a kid in the system who might otherwise protect him from somebody who would not allow him to be himself. Absolutely. And you know, my husband uh is is a researcher into like gay youth and stuff like so. He already knew all the statistics about how many queer kids are in the foster system and how many times they’re rejected by their foster families and all of those things. So it was just this like, oh my gosh, this is an amazing opportunity for us and for him. And then we met him and fell in love, and it wasn’t about any of that bullshit at all. It was just about like, oh my gosh.
David:
We met each other, we found each other finally, yeah.
SPEAKER_03:
Exactly, exactly. So uh yeah, and so we, you know, we met him and then over the course of a year and all of the crazy bullshit bureaucracy that it takes to adopt a kid from the system. I mean, I know that every every gay parent has like their own journey of what they had to do to get to actually being a parent. Um, the journey through the foster system, especially interstate adoption, oh my god, is is a total nightmare.
David:
Um That’s why I always say gay parents are just inherently better parents. And I don’t mean that I don’t mean that in any other way, other than gay parents have to fight tooth and nail to become parents. And sometimes straight people have to do that too. But every gay person has to really fight to become a parent. And that’s I think it just comes with a lot more um skin in the game.
Gavin:
And so you got Derek when he was 10 years old, right?
SPEAKER_03:
Uh he was yeah, he was 10 when we met him. By the time the adoption went through, he was 11. Um, and uh yeah, I mean, and he came out, you know, like within two weeks of living with us. He was, you know, uh, I think I’m gay. Oh, oh. Oh, surprised.
David:
We are so surprised. Oh no, oh my gosh.
SPEAKER_03:
Yeah, it was very that.
David:
I wish I could have had a camera on you and your husband, like catching each other’s eye, being like, bitch, it’s here. The time will be expected, it’s here.
SPEAKER_02:
Absolutely.
Gavin:
But so along those lines, though, you’ve brought a fully fledged human being into your house. What were those first 48 hours like? I mean, were you ready to be responsible for a child? You had been through the system, et cetera, et cetera. You were trained, you’d taken the classes, et cetera, but still you must have had those first 48 hours. It’s go time. There’s a purple.
SPEAKER_03:
Yeah, absolutely. And it is kind of like a weird, like new roommate situation and also like a new relationship situation, right? Like they, you know, they give you there’s six months, there’s like a six-month trial period, right? And um, you know, first we uh we went and spent uh a few weeks in the state where he was living. Um and uh, you know, spent some time. We, you know, we got like a hotel room kind of situation, but then um the uh, you know, we so we like we we like would visit him during the day, and then his foster mom was amazing enough to um uh find a place where we could stay in like another house in town that was like so we could stay with him, so kind of set up house for a little bit and like just try that out. And that was this, like you said, this weird thing where like all of a sudden there’s this other person that we’re responsible for, and we have to know, you know, his sleep schedule and his medications and you know all of these things, and it’s like oh uh juggling all of that. And it was like, of course, different than bringing home like a crying tiny infant, but also really similar because we still had no fucking idea what to do, right?
David:
And like and you and your husband are now having you’re experiencing a new relationship between each other by watching each other parent, and that whole new that is a new and for me, I I remember with an well, I had an infant because I did turgosy, but like yeah, it was almost a it was a level up for me. Like I saw my husband, I just like it increased the love and and even just like he was just sexier as a dad. Like there was just this new angle, um, which was really fun, and that’s all happening for you in this new house with this new kid. It’s yeah, it’s wild.
SPEAKER_03:
Yeah, it was. It was totally wild, and just kind of uh yeah, you you just don’t know what to do. And like, is it okay to like run around with this kid and like do crazy crap? And like, oh, is it okay to watch this movie? I don’t know, is this age appropriate? Like the the first once once we uh we we we did 30 days there, and then they said, Okay, you can take him back to New York now for a 30-day visit, and in that visit time, air quotes, um, we will work on getting the paperwork taken care of so he can just stay with you in your place in New York. So we did that, and then it was like, okay, well, we’re in New York, let’s do the New York stuff and show this to New York. So we did all the things, and we wanted to take him to a show. Now we are we’ve always wanted to be extremely open and progressive about sexuality and about all that stuff. He had been unfortunately exposed to sexuality in a very bad way at a very early age. So we wanted to normalize that, right? And that, you know, and that’s kind of what we read about and taught. Like, we didn’t want there to be uh the any taboos, we wanted him to use any language with with us that he wanted to, we wanted him to talk about anything with us, answer and ask any questions, absolutely.
David:
This is a safe place for him now, yeah.
SPEAKER_03:
Exactly. And so we had, you know, we talked to him any questions that he had about anything we would answer. And of course, an 11-year-old kid has a zillion questions about everything and wants to know and wants to push the boundaries, right? Because we’re the new parents. So, you know, try out a swear word, try out of this, try out of that, and we’re like, okay, that’s cool, but you know, here’s maybe the situations where to and not to, and you know, all that kind of stuff. Um, and uh so we uh we wanted to take him to his first show, and I don’t know how we ended up at this, but the first show that we took him to see in New York was Avenue Q.
David:
Oh my god.
unknown:
Okay.
SPEAKER_03:
Where you think when you’re walking in, you’re like, oh puppet show. Oh, no, I mean we we knew exactly what it was. We weren’t uh like fooled by any of that, but we, you know, but we just thought, oh, this is cute and like accessible to him in a way because there’s puppets and all of that kind of stuff. And we knew it was racy and all of that. But sitting there watching it again and then seeing an 11-year-old react to it, and we’re like, oh this is yeah, oh God, what have we done? Right. But he, of course, loved it. And we went backstage and met the puppets and the whole thing. Um, you know, being in the industry, my kid is completely spoiled. Anytime we go to see any show, he’s like, So who do you know? Who are we visiting backstage? Exactly.
Gavin:
Oh, we have exactly the same sense of entitlement. Like when she lists off all the shows that she’s seen, and then she’s like, and then we got to we went to the Lion King, but my dad didn’t know anybody in it, so we didn’t get to go backstage at that one.
David:
That’s embarrassing.
Gavin:
I know it was she decided. What is the matter with you? Uh-huh. That’s amazing. So uh so, Corter, this is uh all a thoroughly entertaining story. I’m curious. So, right when you Derek entered your life, how soon did you set up the Facebook network of all of the drag queens who are parents that you were able to then foster?
SPEAKER_03:
Well, here’s the thing. I have not yet met another drag queen who is like actually a parent. I now that it’s been a while and I, you know, I’ve had, you know, uh press, you know, uh reporters reach out to me and you know, things like that. I’ve I’ve now read about like another like there’s another one in, you know, Minneapolis. And there might be another one, you know, and but it’s like you’re this rare silver locket somebody’s looking for.
David:
Like, oh, I heard there’s another one in a thrift shop in Alabama. Yeah.
SPEAKER_03:
That’s exactly what it is. It’s really, you know, and I I totally get it because drag, especially pre-pandemic, um, things have changed a little bit, is such a like a late night job, right? Like it, I mean, I might even now my show on Mondays that I regularly do in New York when I’m there doesn’t start until 10 p.m. You know, and anyone with a brain is in bed by then.
David:
I’ve been asleep for 45 minutes at that point, I want to tell you.
SPEAKER_03:
And you know, it starts then, I don’t get finished till midnight. That means I’m counting tips until 12:30. It means I’m not, you know, and getting on the train at one, you know, so I’m not getting home until like 2 a.m. Like it’s it’s just this really difficult thing. And there’s this weird, stupid societal stigma around, you know, oh well, drag means sex in some way. And that which is ridiculous because drag is just like any a drag performer is just like any other kind of performer where we all have our strengths and our talents and the things that we take advantage of, you know, in our you know, performance. We’re not all relying on sex and and all of that kind of stuff.
David:
But but they’re picking and choosing because drag does mean sex for a lot of people and a lot of performances, but it also doesn’t when it’s not. Like people that that that’s what people love to pick and choose about this whole drag reading books to children thing where it’s like, yeah, but that drag queen also showed his butt on Instagram one time on his private account. Yeah, well, now you’re showing the kids that private thing that they would have never seen. And also that was not meant for them. When he reads the books, that’s for the fucking kids. But they they they love to pick and choose all of that stuff to make sure, like, well, drag queen did a sexy number one time late at night in Midtown. Like, yeah, I also shit on the in-train one time by myself. I don’t shit on the in train all the time. I had some rough street food and it was late. Absolutely.
SPEAKER_03:
And listen, kids shit on the end train daily, right?
David:
Yeah, daily.
Gavin:
Uh so Corter, have you shit on the end train? How sexual is Cacophony Daniels, for instance? Especially, did Cacophony Daniels have a different personality before and after Derek?
SPEAKER_03:
You know, no, not really. I mean, I’m I’m I’m pretty much doing the same uh kinds of things. You know, you every performer with their salt knows their audience, right? And is gonna do what’s appropriate for that audience. I, you know, I do drag, you know, on stages in theaters, in cabarets, at bars, on gay cruises, you know, ever and and at, you know, and at brunches where there are kids present, all of those things. You you know your audience, and you know, okay, this is where I’m gonna do my fuck Donald Trump number and you know, and and make dick jokes. And this is the one where I’m gonna be a fairy princess and you know, read about you know how everyone can wear a dress, right?
David:
Like it’s I don’t know why people choose, I think it’s their choosing, choose to not understand that. Yeah, well, that’s scary. Yeah.
Gavin:
They’re scared, you know, they’re scared they’re scared of their own identities and their own expression and and what the the questions the kids are gonna ask, et cetera, et cetera.
SPEAKER_03:
But like you know, so it’s and and often I feel like even when when there are kids in the room at a show where I’m like, oh, I didn’t know, you know, I do um one of the things that I do is um I have a uh cabaret that is a tribute to Bet Midler, where I’m not I’m not being Bet Midler, I’m just singing songs from her career and all that kind of stuff. And when you’re talking about Bette Midler, you talk about the fact that she started in a bathhouse and you, you know, and you tell um the Sophie Tucker jokes because that’s part of what you’re doing, right? Like, and so I’ve had like you know, I did the show in P Town and people brought their kids to the show because I had seen them on the street and the kids wanted to see. And so, you know, it was like, okay, and the kids and even the kids’ parents were fine with the blue jokes that I was telling as Beth Midler’s, you know, jokes in this show. It was the other adults in the audience seeing the kids who had a problem with those jokes happening. Oh, yeah. You know, but and that’s the thing, is that we we get this thing in our head where oh, protect those unknown children. It’s like, okay, let the parents protect their children because that’s their job. And you know, just as we have, you know, parental discretion advised, give the parents the right to have the discretion and let them choose for their kids, you know. So have you done drag uh drag queen story hour? I have just once, um, in Staten Island of all places. I don’t recommend it. Um and yeah, and it was it was a few years ago, but it was still the kind of thing where the library, it was a public library that I was doing it. It was uh it was during pride, so they wanted to do uh Drag Queen Story Hour. And um, but the library had gotten some black backlash from someone, and so didn’t publicize it and didn’t um you know make it a thing, and so only like three families showed up. Uh, we had a lovely time, and I brought my son and my husband, so that was great. We had a lovely time, but yeah, I had you know beat my.
David:
When these public um institutions, uh the library, target, whatever, back down from people being mad on Facebook, right? It just lights the fire underneath them and says, guess what? You can do that anywhere and look like you can shut shit down. And so it’s so disappointing when they’re like, Yeah, we’re just not gonna advertise it. Like, you’re making it worse. You’re not you’re not you’re not making it safer for us to come here. You’re making it worse.
SPEAKER_03:
Yeah, absolutely. You’re not making it safer for anyone to survive if you’re you know uh letting those voices win for sure.
Gavin:
So But but boy, I bet Cacophony was able to let out a little bit of sarcasm about are you kidding me? I come all the way to Staten Island for three fucking kids? Jesus.
SPEAKER_03:
Yes. Well, unfortunately, my husband was actually born in Staten Island. Uh oh, you should get a divorce immediately.
Gavin:
Ixnay, Ixnay on the Staten Island joke.
SPEAKER_03:
No, no, no, no. Please leap all of the horribleness upon it you can. They’re the only like Republican place in all of New York City, right? So fuck that.
Gavin:
Did you did you get in full beat that morning and then ride the Staten Island Ferry over?
SPEAKER_03:
No.
Gavin:
I had rented car- Which would be awesome.
SPEAKER_03:
No, I had rented a car because I wasn’t about to get on the Staten Island Ferry.
David:
No. Unless you’re talking about a Staten Island Ferry. You know what I mean? If you’re gonna ride a Staten Island ferry, different different conversation.
SPEAKER_03:
Then they’re gonna live in St. George and be right off that ferry stop. Thank you. Yes.
Gavin:
And does Derek ever give cacophony notes on her performances?
SPEAKER_03:
Um, oh yes, every once in a while, Derek does. Derek has a um, because he’s been exposed to so much theater and you know, been backstage and all those kinds of things, he does have this sense of knowing. I mean, and and also because he’s a teenager at this point, so you know they fucking know everything. But like, okay, he like, you know, I think you should do this on this number instead, or you know, that the that note sounded a little funky, dad, like that kind of thing.
David:
And it’s like Wow, that note was a little, yeah. Make sure, Dad, you want to hit the note on uh above it, not come underneath. Yeah, yeah. Wow.
SPEAKER_02:
Wow.
David:
That is hilarious.
SPEAKER_03:
Absolutely.
David:
You know, it’s so funny. When I was a kid, drag scared me, and I still can’t decide if it’s because there was like a gayness in me that was afraid of being caught. I don’t think it was. I think it was that I was a very shy kid who was, I was kind of chubby and obviously very feminine. So I was like nerd, people would make fun of me a lot, and something about a drag queen’s over the top personality I was afraid would turn on me and make fun of me. And so I had this fear, like going all the way into my early 20s, of like, whenever I would go be near a drag queen, I would kind of cower and go away because I was so afraid of being made fun of. Because I think at the time all the drag queens I’d ever seen were like. Always making fun of people in the front row, kind of a deal. And that was my fear. And now obviously drag is a totally different than it was. But this was back in the 1800s when drag was mostly about being made fun of. Gaben, I’m making fun of myself for being old, not you. So I appreciate that.
Gavin:
I’m here for it. I’m always here for it.
SPEAKER_03:
Gabin’s like a decade older than me, but I think, but I do think that that’s why people are in general scared of drag queens, is because a drag queen is someone who takes all of those pieces of themselves that they might otherwise be afraid of, that they might otherwise be ashamed of, and puts them out on full display. Right. Not only here is all of my gayness, but here’s all of my femininity that I might try to hide even as a proud gay man, because we all often try to hide our femininity in whatever ways to be more mask and all that kind of stuff. So here’s all my femininity, here’s all my gayness, here are the parts of my body that I’m not proud of, you know, and then here is fearless in a way that nobody is. Exactly. And here is glitter and makeup and all of these things. And it’s like here, it’s all on display. Look at it, everyone. Look at it. And and yes, I might make fun of you, but also make fun of me, right? Like it’s all of that. It’s opening yourself up to all of it all at once. Um, and you know, some people don’t have the option. Like you, you know, you talked about how you, you know, you’re feminine and all those things. We don’t always have the option to hide those parts of ourselves, right? Um, and in drag, you not only, you know, you you literally put it out on display all the time for everyone to see.
David:
I also think I some of this is the culture of drag has changed, but some of this is my perception of this change, where like the making fun of the I’ve especially now with like the popularity of RuPaul, where you see all the shade and the reading is actually a form of love. And it’s and and I and it’s this this is this is why Gavin and I love, or I love Gavin. I don’t know if Gavin loves me anymore, but like I make fun of him relentlessly because and and this does anybody in my inner circle of friends know that it is like vicious attacks after vicious attack, and that is actual love. If I like say, Hi, how are you? You look nice today, I hate you. I like I fully hate you. But if I’m like, you look tired, Gavin, that is me saying I’m obsessed with you. Obsessed with you in your bags underneath your eyes. So I think that was something else. I don’t mean any of that, of course. Uh Gavin, you’re muted, by the way, which is actually very convenient right now because I was making fun of you. He was I saw him mouthing words and I was like, you know, it’s probably something mean to me anyway.
Gavin:
Fully, fully, fully, fully, fully. Yeah, that was uh excellent mute timing. That’s anyway. Um I completely relate to that also. That drag intimidates me a little bit because as a really narcissistic performer myself, I’m always afraid of being caught uh speechless or not funny. And I’m afraid a drag queen is gonna talk to me and I’m gonna have nothing to say. And that terrifies me to actually be addressed by a drag queen. Uh it’s uh I should get over that, huh?
David:
So, Quarter, you are like the like you are the prime target right now for people who are on the right and crazy and think that you are molesting children all day. So, like, I I guess my question for you is like, A, that must feel fucking exhausting to have to constantly explain yourself and be the target of attacks. But B, do you have any advice for people who may be either in your position or are an ally in a fucking insane state like Florida or something? Like, what do you do in these times where you’re the you’re the target?
SPEAKER_03:
Yeah, I mean, I I didn’t I didn’t even know how much I was internalizing all of this messaging and all of this crap from the right and everything until I I showed up here to Arizona for our first day of rehearsals and the theater company like made a point to um not only like publicly put out a statement in support of the queer community and of drag in particular, um, but then like read that statement to us at the beginning of the first rehearsal. Like the artistic director stood up and and um and you know, and the management of the theater read this statement to all of us, and I just burst into tears. I didn’t realize how much I was taking all of this in and how much I was like putting all of that on my shoulders, and I don’t think any of us do. We read the news and we see this constant barrage of queer hate, right? And and you know, and and and and hatred of our trans brothers and sisters and and all of these things, and and we just kind of like we feel like we can just like shrug it off because it happens all the time, but really it’s piling on and piling on. So the first thing I would say is like quote advice to anybody would be just like recognize that it fucking sucks and that it hurts every time, and and don’t try to you know be brave in every moment because like it’s okay to take that on and be like, this sucks, that there is this. I mean, granted, they’re absolutely the minority, they’re absolutely just loud and hateful, but they’re out there, and to feel that kind of hatred sucks, right? So that’s like the first thing. But then the thing that I would say to every ally out there, to every person who has any kind of privilege, right, to be an ally rather than be, you know, the person who’s being victimized in that moment, is like stand up and vocally be that ally. It’s it’s not enough to support me at home. It’s not enough to, you know, give me a hug when I’m feeling down. If when you’re at work someone says something and you don’t stand up to it, if you’re an organization that is, you know, uh that is claiming to have pride and then backing down from that, it’s not enough to just say something. You have to literally stand up on a daily basis to everyone, in a way that the queer people in your life, the trans people in your life, the questioning people in your life can see it and feel that support.
David:
Especially in the spaces where queer people aren’t, in those side conversations, in the hallway, in straight spaces. That’s where the standing up means so much.
Gavin:
Absolutely visibility everywhere, even behind closed doors, behind in all of the places that uh that that are not always uh well populated. I agree with you entirely.
SPEAKER_03:
Yeah, yeah. It’s I mean that it it that just means so much to us and helps lighten that load a little bit to feel like there’s someone else out there who’s got my back in the moments where I need to just break down in the corner for a second. You know, it it means so much to have that. And we, you know, we’ve got to be there for each other, right? Any uh all like the bullshit in our community where we’re where we’re this like circular firing squad who like constantly, well, you called me this when I really want to be called this, and you, you know, I’m pansexual, you said bisexual, and I wanna like all of that kind of stuff.
David:
Yes, those are important conversations, but not let’s not let’s not tear each other down while they’re murdering us, while the people outside this circle, this firing squad, are literally actively trying to kill us.
SPEAKER_03:
Yes, yes, and yeah, and like say what you will about Lady Bunny, and she’s got some extreme views. But she the other day on Instagram was like, Oh, so we’re all supposed to be mad at Target right now? Are we done being mad at the people who are murdering trans people? No. Let’s let’s keep the anger stoked where it needs to be instead of being angry at each other. Let’s support each other and of course educate each other as we go.
Gavin:
Corter, thank you for demeaning yourself and spending time with us on our podcast, stupid little podcast.
David:
You are way too good for this show, and I’m surprised too good for this show. It is totally true.
Gavin:
But thank you. Thank you for making truly the world a much better place. Every dick joke and bet midler song at a time. Thank you, thank you, thank you. So something great happened this morning when I, my middle schooler had to go to school late, and so sh we both dropped off my elementary kid together, and he is still in a phase that he will wave to me driving away in the bus. And I know that he’s over it. I know that he just does it to make me happy, but he goes all the way until he goes around the corner and I can’t see him anymore. And this morning, my middle schooler was so excited to wave to him and make him laugh um with me. And instead, he just looked with devil eyes at us, like, you guys are so fucking lame. And the something great was that my middle schooler was enthusiastic to do it, and that my little one still does it, except today where he just um gave us hateful eyes, and it was frankly fantastic. So, hey, all those kids out there listening, please wave to your kids, your parents on the bus for as long as you possibly can. It makes them so happy.
David:
Aww. So, my something great is actually a similar kind of between my two kids. So, my I have a three and a half year old and a one-year-old, and so the one-year-old has a couple of words, she has no, real fucking good. Um but uh anyway, so we were at um we’re having uh breakfast, and uh I witnessed the first conversation between my two kids that didn’t involve me. Oh and I’ve said this before something about them interacting with each other without me is borderline the most beautiful part of parenting so far for me. And so the conversation went like this, and it was so sweet. Uh Emmett, my son, walked up to Hannah and she goes, Do you want some oatmeal? And she went, No. And that was it. That was the whole conversation. But it was like, it like borderline made me tear up because I was like, oh my god, they’re like talking to each other. They had a conversation. And so I don’t know, that felt really great this week. So that’s my something great.
Gavin:
That’s this week, and the next week is gonna be life, religion, politics, and art. And uh anal. That’s our show. If you have any comments, suggestions, or general compliments, you can email us at gatriarchspodcast at gmail.com.
David:
Or you can DM us on Instagram. We are at Gatriarchspodcast. On the internet, David is at David FM VaughnEverywhere, and Gavin is at GavidLodge on nothing.
Gavin:
Please leave us a glowing five-star review wherever you get your podcasts.
David:
Thanks, and we’ll see you next time on another episode of Gatriarchs.
SPEAKER_03:
So uh when we first adopted uh our son, um, we uh, you know, we were uh traveling around, having him meet everyone in the family. And as I told you, my husband was born in Staten Island. So we were going out to Staten Island, I think it was for Thanksgiving or something like that. And we are um we’re you know, we rented a car to drive out there, and he had he was like newly with us. I think this was November, and we’d only met him in like August. And so we’re still trying to like be the cool dads and all that kind of stuff. And my son loves to make up jokes, he likes to make up silly punny jokes and things like that. Um, one of his favorites that he made up is um, what is a gay man’s favorite book? A dick scenery, right?
David:
Like, like that’s what like your son and my my husband would be basties. They love a bad dad joke, yeah. Exactly. Yes.
SPEAKER_03:
And so and so we’re in the car and I’m driving and I’m like, okay, wait, he’s gonna love this joke, right? And we all know this joke, like, what do gay horses eat? Hey, right, we all know that joke, right? So I’m there, I’m like, so he tells me one of his jokes, and I’m like, oh that’s great. I’m like, oh hey, hey, buddy, um what do gay horses eat? And he goes, I don’t know, dick. Oh he’s 11.
David:
I am a gog.
Gavin:
Wow. That is hey, is Derek available next week to be our new gift?
SPEAKER_03:
You know, if you ever want to have, you know, a queer teen on your podcast, he would be someone to have for sure.
Gavin:
Thank you for giving us that gift today. Yeah.